Monday 25 August 2014
Staff - what do you think?
Larkin (1964) is writing about how love fades over time in 'Talking in Bed' but Eliot (1957) writes about how much promise love holds in 'Dedication To My Wife'. Which of the perspectives do you agree with and how do you think the poets have been influenced by the Post-WW2 context?
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ReplyDeleteLarkin is as negative as Eliot is positive; the true reality is somewhere in between. Longevity leading to difficulty in finding "words not untrue and not unkind" is a disturbing and deeply saddening prospect to those in the early throes of a new relationship and memories of the promise of what love hoped to be are equally saddening for many.
DeleteI agree
DeleteThis is from Margaret
DeleteElliot is very biological in his relationship analysis, Larkin is very psychological in his approach
Talking in bed seems more honest about trials and tribulations of marraige, Dedication to my wife seems more rose tinted. Dedication to my wife sounds like a letter from a soldier away, where as Talking in Bed seems more like a solider returned, unable to share experiences. I wouldnt say one is more negative and the other positive, that depends on perception of marraige and love.
DeleteI agree with you, marriage is personal and other perspectives can be powerful and irrelevant
Deletewdwdwdwd
ReplyDeleteMarie-Hélène : Both very poignant and probably both a bit true. I'm going with TS Eliot because Larkin depresses me! Eliot's poem reminds me of a great one by Ronsard which I adore!
ReplyDeleteMarie Helene who is Ronsard?
ReplyDeleteExcellent use of metaphor in 'Talking in Bed' e.g. '...dark towns.'
ReplyDeleteI agree with nsfg5. It also depends on what has occurred in the relationship.
ReplyDeleteReading the Larkin poem does make me feel quite sad about the state of the relationship being spoken of - it makes me feel as though there have been bitter experiences, whereas the Eliot poem is vastly different and romantic in the true sense of the word
ReplyDeleteI love the language that Eliot has used 'babble' 'peevish' and 'sullen' etc, which you would not normally associate with a love poem. However, the very ordinary nature of some of the language used makes the message of love more believable.
DeleteIt is amazing that both of the poems are as true as can be in regards to relationships. That complete elation and joy that being with someone can give you and the despair it can also bring.
ReplyDeleteEven if the title Talking in bed seems positive, the poem is about the difficulty to keep the passion alive in the relationship.
ReplyDeleteDepending on the readers experiences and perspective both poems portray a view of love at differing stages. In terms of the WW2 context it could be influenced by the amount of time in the relationship post WW2 and at what point in the relationship the poets are, or the readers may be.
ReplyDeleteEliot seems to have written the poem as if from afar and serving during the war. It is almost of how he remembers his wife and fondly looks forward to the future.
ReplyDeleteLarkin writes as if he is a soldier returned from the war and faces the harsh reality which is not so rose tinted.
Really liked the positivity in A Dedication to My Wife, it's inspiring to read and shows that love can be kept alive over a long period of time; whereas with Talking in Bed it sets a negative tone like a couple who had allowed themselves to drift apart over time which is a little sad.
ReplyDeleteDepends on how new/old the relationship is. Have these couples spent the same time together? Have they been parted at all for any period of time.
ReplyDeleteI think both perspectives are right in their own way, it would depend on whether you were at the start or end of a relationship
ReplyDeleteColeridge likens her poem to tragic love story. Love is this all consuming all encompassing entity, like a spider using her wrapping her spider fly protectively in her webbing. Keats is very much a mutual sharing love of two becoming one, rather than one person taking over.
ReplyDeleteOne poem has a very positive stance on love and romance, almost like the two bodies are one and love is unbinding. The Larkin poem demonstrates the flaws in relationships. Much like in real life, love can be complicated, distressing etc.
ReplyDeleteLarkin is more realistic as life is not all roses - however he is very negative and this to me is typical of many soldiers who thought in the war and couldn't get over the horrors.
ReplyDeleteEliot's poem is more romantic and reminds me of a letter home or a relationship that is still fresh and new.
I agree yes I feel one of the poem has a positive note about relationship whereas the other one looks closely at the flaws in relationships. Life is brilliant when you can sail in the middle and not take sides.
ReplyDeleteThe roses in the rose-garden in the Eliot poem speaks of their relationship being beautiful and nurtured and their closeness even when not speaking. However, the Larkin poem speaks of a growing distance in the couple's relationship and a sense of foreboding with the clouds and "dark towns" - maybe a break-up is coming.
ReplyDeleteEliot describes passion and lust of new love within his words, whereas Larkin describes the long standing companionship of a marriage and perhaps the distance that may grow. The relationship Larkin discusses shows more loneliness and distance, this could suggest that the marriage has been influenced by the sorrows of war:
ReplyDelete“And dark towns heap up on the horizon.
None of this cares for us. Nothing shows why
At this unique distance from isolation”
Both poems are set in ‘bed’, the ultimate privacy of a relationship. Larkin suggests he is unable to voice his concerns. Eliot suggests that nothing will affect their relationship because they are one:
“No peevish winter wind shall chill
No sullen tropic sun shall wither
The roses in the rose-garden which is ours and ours only”
I agree that both poets represent aspects of relationships.
Larkin has produced a beautiful piece of poetry pointing out the most wonderful moments between two people.
ReplyDeleteSmelly bodies in a love poem is disgusting
ReplyDeletewho says that smell is negative
ReplyDeleteBoth poems are equally true in what they say as in a relationship there are ups and downs always. Everybody can read them depending on the stage of their relationship.
ReplyDeleteEliot's perspective suggests that his war experience has endeared his wife to him and he now has a greater appreciation of the simple things in life, such as a rose garden. Larkin has been left bereft by war and estranged from the one person who should know him best.
ReplyDelete